Topics: Re-opening Kyiv Embassy;
0710 AEST
29 August 2024
Bridget Brennan: Well, the Coalition has unveiled plans to re-establish an Australian Embassy in Kyiv if it wins the next federal election. To tell us more, we’re joined from the Ukrainian capital by the Shadow Foreign Minister, Simon Birmingham. Welcome to the program. Thanks a lot for your time from Ukraine.
Simon Birmingham: Good morning. It’s good to be with you.
Bridget Brennan: Just tell us firstly what it’s like being there in Ukraine. Obviously, there’s been a number of attacks and escalations over the past few days. What’s the atmosphere been like? Have you felt safe and how are everyday Ukrainians faring?
Simon Birmingham: This is a war that’s in its third year, tragically now, for Kyiv and for large parts of Ukraine, they have built the protections to keep themselves relatively safe – the early warning systems, the air defence systems, which have ensured that this latest huge assault by Russia has been largely ineffective for large parts of the country, including the capital here. So of course, people are on alert for their safety, alert for those air warning sirens that may go off and the apps that people install on their phones to be aware of that and to be able to take swift precautionary action. But on the whole, they are getting on with business, getting on with ensuring that this country is as strong as possible to repel the Russian invasion, which, of course, they have done with enormous success and exceeding all expectations throughout the last two and a half years.
Bridget Brennan: Why do you think it makes sense, Simon Birmingham, to return Australia’s embassy to Kyiv.
Simon Birmingham: It’s critical for Australia as a big supporter of Ukraine and one who should continue to provide military support, humanitarian support, energy assistance to Ukraine, to have the best possible analysis, intelligence and access to inform that assistance we provide. Now our embassy, like many others, was closed when the initial invasion occurred two and a half years ago. But nearly everybody else has come back. In fact, around 70 other embassies have reopened their doors since that time, most of them just months after that initial invasion when it became clear that the capital Kyiv was not going to fall into Russian hands. And the Australian embassy, which is housed in the same building as Canada, sits without an ambassador, whilst Canada sits there fully open. If around 70 other nations, including partners like Canada, the UK and many others, can manage to open and be present and do so safely then it should be within Australia’s capacity to do so as well and to get that best access and intelligence and information.
Bridget Brennan: The last couple of weeks have really demonstrated what a dynamic situation this is in Ukraine and over the border in Russia. Obviously, the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade has had to make a pragmatic and sensible decision about the safety of diplomats in Kyiv over the coming months as the war rages on. Surely, they’ve made the decision not to reopen the embassy, the Government’s taken that advice, and it’s been a sensible decision, hasn’t it?
Simon Birmingham: No, it’s a decision that has left Australia as an international outlier. All of our partners are here and have reopened. Previously Australia has managed situations with embassies in Kabul or in Baghdad during very difficult times. Here in Kyiv obviously, you would take safety precautions, as other nations have done. But this is an environment where our ambassador would have better access to officials, to intelligence, to briefings than is available at present. We’ve got a situation where the Albanese Government is still paying rent for the building that we share with the Canadian Embassy here in Kyiv, but our ambassador is situated some hundreds of kilometres away. He’s doing the best job he possibly can under the rules that are set for him but it puts him and Australia at a disadvantage in how we help Ukraine compared with comparable and like-minded nations who have been able to quite safely manage the circumstances for their personnel and if they can do so, you have to ask the question why is it that Australia cannot.
Bridget Brennan: So, are you saying it compromises our reliability and our position as a supporter of Ukraine?
Simon Birmingham: You’ve seen President Zelenskyy himself being asked about this situation and urging Australia indicating he would warmly welcome back Australia’s ambassador. Its been raised in briefings with me whilst I’ve been here and it’s a situation where it is clear that the way in which particularly sensitive briefings, intelligence and military briefings are provided to other nations can’t all be done remotely, aren’t all done with significant notice and that means that Australia is not present at the time when other countries, not only NATO countries, but other partners like Japan and South Korea are receiving that type of information we just physically can’t be here. It’s critical that if we are going to, as we should, invest significantly in supporting Ukraine, a fellow democracy, to defend itself against Russia, to ensure that Russia is defeated so that it sends a signal to other tyrants and autocrats around the world, then we should be making sure that we have ourselves in the strongest possible position and that does mean having an ambassador here, certainly for so long as all of our other counterparts see that it is safe to do so then we should be able to make it safe to do so too.
Bridget Brennan: Alright, just on another foreign affairs matter, if you wouldn’t mind, Simon Birmingham. We just had a Perth man who’s a doctor, Dr Mustapha, Mohamed Mustapha, who recently went to Gaza to offer his services in a hospital there – predominantly treating children – some who were bleeding out on the floor of the hospital, others who’d lost their heads. A hospital with more than 1000 people with one thermometer between all of the patients. How can we possibly say to families there, that we cannot take a humanitarian intake of refugees from that harrowing conflict?
Simon Birmingham: It is a harrowing conflict. So too is the situation in Myanmar for Rohingya refugees, so too is the situation in Sudan, so too is the situation for families who have been displaced from parts of Ukraine that I met with today. Tragically, there is no shortage of refugees from harrowing situations right around the world and that is not to downplay the situation in Gaza, but it is a reality that Australia is one of the most generous countries in the world when it comes to our refugee intake on a per capita basis…
Bridget Brennan: Not so generous towards Palestinians under your potential government though, is that right?
Simon Birmingham: …well, I completely reject that. But that generosity does require us to ensure that places are filled in accordance with proper security screening and checks. That is not an unreasonable proposition. It is a proposition that is about the wellbeing and safety and security of all Australians. We will never be able to accommodate all of the refugees and all of the demand for places in Australia. It would be wonderful if that were possible, but the number of refugees from the number of crisis zones around the world far outweighs any potential – and that means that it is prudent to undertake appropriate screening and to be judicious about ensuring the people who do get that opportunity to start afresh in Australia are people who pose no threat to the safety and security of Australia.
Bridget Brennan: Simon Birmingham, thanks for joining us on the program. Stay safe while you’re in Ukraine.
Simon Birmingham: Thank you, my pleasure.
[ENDS]