Topics: Israel – Hezbollah conflict; Timeline to Palestinian statehood;
07:45AM AEST
30 September 2024
Steve Cannane: Lebanon cannot become the next Gaza. Those were the words of the Foreign Minister, Penny Wong, as she addressed the UN General Assembly at the weekend. Australia and several other nations, including the US, have called for a temporary ceasefire in Lebanon as the fighting escalates, with Israeli airstrikes killing Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah. But concerns about a broader regional conflict breaking out continued to escalate this morning after Israel struck Iranian backed Houthi rebel targets in Yemen overnight. Simon Birmingham is the Shadow Foreign Affairs Minister and the Leader of the Opposition in the Senate, and he joins us now. Welcome back to Radio National Breakfast.
Simon Birmingham: Good morning, Steve. It’s good to be with you.
Steve Cannane: Thank you. I’ll get your reactions to Penny Wong speech in a moment, but let’s start with the events in the Middle East over the weekend where we saw the assassination of Nasrallah. We saw further strikes inside Lebanon aimed at Hezbollah targets and also inside Yemen against Houthi energy targets. Are you concerned that these attacks increase the chance of a broader conflict in the region.
Simon Birmingham: Steve, none of us wish to see a broader regional escalation to conflict, and we all wish to see an outcome of peace. But we should remember always that Hezbollah is a terrorist organisation, that Nasrallah was a terrorist and that he was a terrorist responsible for leading an organisation that had killed many and of course, caused ongoing and massive disruption to many, many more, including through the indiscriminate firing of ultimately thousands of missiles towards Israel and the commitment of him and his organisation to the destruction of Israel. So, of course, his death is not something to be mourned and the scenes we saw in protests around Australia, and particularly in Melbourne and Sydney yesterday, were reprehensible and disgusting scenes that clearly deserve strong action from the Albanese Government.
Steve Cannane: Iran’s supreme leader has said the death of Nasrallah will not go unavenged. Surely this increases the chances of Iran getting directly involved in this conflict.
Simon Birmingham: Iran is responsible for so much of this conflict. Iran funds and sponsors Hezbollah, Hamas, the Houthi rebels, as well. Iran’s sponsorship of regional terrorism, is frankly, why we face the type of devastating situation that so many people are in. Be those the Israeli families who still have hostages held or who lost loved ones nearly 12 months ago, be they the people, the Palestinians in Gaza who have faced such enormous suffering, or now Lebanese people displaced, all of it can come back in many ways to that Iranian sponsorship of terrorism. And it’s why we should see stronger global action. Calling out Iran, acting on Iran. And in the case of the Albanese Government, Australia should be taking steps to list the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps as a terrorist organisation, given its sponsorship of such worldwide terrorism.
Steve Cannane: Last week we saw a wide range of Western allies, including the US. France, the UK, Canada and Australia and many others put out a statement calling for an immediate 21-day ceasefire across the Lebanon-Israel border to try and reach a diplomatic solution to that situation. Did you support that ceasefire proposal?
Simon Birmingham: Well, Steve, obviously as an opposition, we weren’t engaged in the discussions, but it was a statement that included some of, indeed most of, Australia’s closest partners and allies. We would wish to see, as I said before, a peaceful outcome and as that statement made clear, what it wanted to see achieved was enforcement of UN Security Council Resolution 1701, which is a long-standing resolution that Hezbollah has acted in breach of. A resolution designed to keep those types of Hezbollah forces away from Israel’s northern border to create, in essence, almost a demilitarised zone there that can give both Lebanese people and Israeli people comfort and safety to live within those border regions. We absolutely support that as an outcome and would wish to see diplomatic efforts achieve that, if at all possible.
Steve Cannane: Let’s talk about Penny Wong’s speech to the UN. The Foreign Minister called for a clear timeline for international declaration of Palestinian statehood. Do you agree with that?
Simon Birmingham: No, we don’t. This is very much a case of sending all of the wrong incentives and signals. We don’t need an arbitrary timeline for Palestinian statehood. We need to see clear preconditions for Palestinian statehood.
Steve Cannane: Can’t you do both?
Simon Birmingham: An arbitrary timeline essentially gives an incentive to people, and particularly to Hamas and others, to run the clock down towards that timeline to get statehood without releasing hostages, without providing security guarantees or indeed without settling the very difficult issues such as agreed borders of new states, agreed decisions around sensitive matters like rights of return for citizens and so-called citizens in different situations. So, I think all of us know that these are very, very complex issues. And just going out and saying, well, there should be a timeline to achieve it, doesn’t do anything aside from, as I say, send the wrong signals. When what we do need is to see parties come to the table, the Palestinian Authority reform into a credible non-corrupt organisation and to see security guarantees given ultimately in both directions. So, Israel can live safe and secure, as well as a new state of Palestine, ultimately have its own security, too.
Steve Cannane: Okay. Just briefly, what other preconditions would you like to see before there was a timeline towards Palestinian statehood?
Simon Birmingham: Well, Steve, as I said, there’s the immediate ones, which is to see the release of hostages, the disarming of Gaza and removal of terrorist infrastructure and capabilities. Then there is the need for security guarantees between the parties. And then you have the longer-term preconditions for a state to work, which are, of course, secure borders, agreed borders, agreements around rights of return. Each of those requires a lot of work and negotiation. As people like Bill Clinton have demonstrated, you can get very, very close. But we’ve seen, tragically, Palestinian leaders and others walk away from that in the past.
Steve Cannane: Okay, Senator, we’ll have to leave it there. But thank you for your time this morning.
Simon Birmingham: Thank you, Steve. My pleasure.